Con roof completed !

[BEZBOZNY]

Tell me about it Russell if I was an Advisor I would do these too. We have booked appointments for football players with double conservatorys and Advisors walking out with orders so big a tear comes to their eyes. I would recommend them to everyone

[desmorse]

Greenpesto,
agree with using 3,1/2" face brackets on 25mm freehang. Only question, why on earth are you selling 25mm? 20mm looks much better, and earns more commission. I don't think any of my local competitors sell 25mm, and I won't offer unless it's a roof greater than 3mt drop. If you have a price problem, offer 20mm and beat-a-quote, you'll still earn more than with 25mm.

I do much the same on roof, and always offer powercrank, esp. if customer is elderly. It's so much easier to operate. Again if price is a problem, offer to price match manual, then add premium for power crank. i.e. if we're £800 for manual and £1,000 for crank, and competition are £700 for manual, offer £700 BaQ plus £200 for crank, so you've now got a £900 order and they're no more difficult to fit than manual, though I must admit to a DOR being more likely

[greenpesto]

25mm roof blinds are very forgiving & I still find that I fit them quicker & easier than 20mm.
The job always looks better ( .... YES! ... I know you'll disagree! ) I've also found that apart from tighter tolerences with 20mm I'm having service calls with 20mm which I never ( Touch Wood! ) get with the 25mm system.
I'd be happy fitting these all day long.
The 25mm is robust, trouble free, reliable & has more shape & size options etc than its 20mm counterpart. The best thing to come out of 20mm is the 'Angle bracket' which I ALWAYS use on the 25mm system. If we could have this bracket in a 25mm version we'd be laughing.
I had a great arguement on the refresher training course a year or so back about the merits of fitting the side rails 'back to back' on the 20mm. This I still feel looks better, but you can imagine the look of horror on the trainers faces!!!! The 'finished look' on the training conservatory looks dreadful with that 'wonky' gap between the side rails..

[desmorse]

Understand your view on roof blinds, greenpesto, but not on freehang. The 20mm is neater, with slimmer rail and better cord lock. If doing a conservatory, you can use tab blinds on doors, rather than the cobbled together hybrid available on 25mm (wonder if that's available on SAM?)

I think tab blinds are one of the best products to come out of Hillarys in years. It's just a pity that both the 20mm pleat system and curved verticals are German. Still it could have been worse, they could have been French

[JoY]

Can you really measure a roof in 30 minutes???

Or was that a joke? Doesn't the pythagoras alone take longer than that?

Or are talking lean to's? ;D

[desmorse]

dibsdob,
depends on the roof. Lean to, couldn't agree more, but 20+ shaped powercrank, £4k+ order. Four hours fit???
I'd like to see it

[russell]

4 hours do you use blue tack takes me 6 on a 12 blind victorian crank or 25 prefer 25 too fit and less dors can measure 30 mins though and have never had mismeasure ;D yet!!!!!

[russell]

trolly on wheels not on your life anyway have had fsm visit once this year so doubt they be checking ;D

[desmorse]

Pyramid,
if the tab blinds you are doing are quite wide, you may find the bottom rail bows. Slacking off the tension at the bottom doesn't help, you have to stretch the springs in the headrail.
To all of you shouting "THAT'S THE SAME THING". - "OH NOT IT ISN'T".
I thought the same when told, but it works and I got the tip from none other than Kevin Salmon, who knows a bit about these blinds.
I've also had 20mm freehang become uneven after several months. The cords running through the blind are all tied together inside the bottom rail and hooked in to the end cap opposite side to controls. I've had 3 of these caps break, but can be swapped with the top rail end cap. Quick and easy when you know how, first took me 3/4 hour and stripping down another blind to see how it worked

[blue movie man]

disdobs JACKANORY JACKANORY

[greenpesto]

'dibsdobs' .... apart from a silly bag with wheels ....what new launch?

[dibsdobs]

An overhaul of the 20mm system, making it more user friendly, and hopefully getting rid of those silly side rails.

Sales of 20mm roof have been very poor, due to most advisor's steering well clear. For these to succeed there has to be a significant improvement in the product finish.

I will not sell them and have walked away from jobs, and I sell alot of roofs.

Also I believe hillarys would win alot more cons roof orders if they send only fully clued up advisor's in to the appointment.
Example..
I sell lots in my area, so know it is a good area for roofs, also cover surrounding areas for other advisor's who are not qualified. Their area should be better than mine,yet they hardly sell any,maybe one a year!!
Sanderson would not dream of sending someone in who doesn't know what their talking about. So why does hillarys.

Now I get the backlash from all the unqualified advisor's who think they can sell roofs properly. But I honestly believe ( and can almost prove) if you ain't fitted any you ain't properly qualified to sell any! Yes you might get lucky occasionally, but i bet you lose more than you gain.
Hillarys really need to look at this if the want to compete with Sanderson as they say they do.
However I also believe ( and you guys can back me up on this ) that Sanderson is not really our main competition, its the local guys.

[JoY]

Dibdobs....Totally agree with your points about trying to sell roof blinds when you haven't fitted them. I find myself waffling when asked anything too technical.... (I sell, hubby fits)

But I always thought we didn't so much lose the sale to the opposition, but because of the cost involved. Maybe it's my selling then........

[farmer]

no Joy, its the cost. I have been selling and fitting them for years.
trouble is it aint worth doing the job, for less than list price. You need at least 200 quid for fitting a roof of average size.
Its the same old chestnut, Hillarys take the lions share of everything. 14.68% just is no longer enough.

How do you measure properly in 30 mins, dibsdobs. I would love to see your finished work.
what am i doing wrong ? am I being too carefull

[farmer]

totally agree dibsdobs.
Sandersons in fact usually win it for me, 'cos of their price.
I like their system better than ours though.
The 20mm system of ours is a nightmare.
I have neen told by the "main man" in pleateds, to steer clear of them..................!!!!!!
As usual we are the guinea pigs, we usually end up telling the so called boffins how to go on, cos its us who are fitting them.
Twas a Hillarys thingy up of mine that brought the whole new way of doing roofs, and pythagoras a good few years ago.

They just dont talk to us and discuss owt. They talk AT US, like school children !!

Well the only thing they get right is the funds they can throw at the advertising. But as a lot of my customers are saying "Hillarys are getting too big to care now, its all a numbers game, just move on to the next one".

Even had one guy (no names) telling me to screw an old pensioner for all she's got, 'cos the oldies have loadsa money. YES MELISSA I CAN PROVIDE THE NAME. He wants a slapping for starters.

Can you see what I am trying to say.....